La Prison De Guantanamo

[Chitah]

Ce fil est la suite de celui que vous trouverez ici: http://www.liberaux.org/index.php?showtopic=2632&st=200

Pour nos amis qui nous ont rejoints ici récemment, j'en conseille la lecture, il comprend beaucoup d'informations intéressantes sur le sujet brûlant de la prison de Guantanamo et de tous les lieux d'incarcérations de ce type dans le monde.

Aujourd'hui est apparu dans la presse une nouvelle: apparemment, le Pentagone a réussi à faire ajouter un amendement à une loi de finance, qui réduit considérablement les droits des détenus de ces prisons pour "combattants etrangers".

Reste à savoir si la loi en question va être votée.

Qu'en pensez-vous?

Guantanamo inmates to lose all rights

US law proposal attacked by campaigners

David Rose

Sunday November 13, 2005

The Observer

Human rights campaigners are calling it the 'November surprise' - a last-minute amendment smuggled into a Pentagon finance bill in the US Senate last Thursday.

Its effects are likely to be devastating: the permanent removal of almost all legal rights from 'war on terror' detainees at Guantanamo Bay and every other similar US facility on foreign or American soil.

'What the British law lord Lord Steyn once called a legal black hole had begun to be filled in,' said the British lawyer Clive Stafford Smith, speaking from Guantanamo, where he represents more than 40 detainees. 'It looks as if it is back, and deeper than before.'

If the amendment passes the House of Representatives unmodified, one of its immediate effects is that Stafford Smith and all the other lawyers who act for Guantanamo prisoners will again be denied access, as they were for more than two years after Camp X-Ray opened in 2002.

The amendment was tabled by Lindsay Graham, a South Carolina Republican, and passed by 49 votes to 42. It reverses the Supreme Court's decision in June last year which affirmed the right of detainees to bring habeas corpus petitions in American federal courts.

As a result, about 200 of Guantanamo's 500 prisoners have filed such cases, many of them arguing that they are not terrorists, as the US authorities claim, and that the evidence against them is unreliable.

None of them were given any kind of hearing when they were consigned to Guantanamo. Instead, the Americans unilaterally declared they were unlawful 'enemy combatants', mostly on the basis of assessments by junior military intelligence personnel, who were often reliant on interpreters whose skills internal Pentagon reports have criticised.

The Supreme Court's 2004 ruling also meant that the handful of prisoners facing trial at Guantanamo by military commissions, which do not follow the normal rules of evidence and due process, have been able to file federal challenges to their legality.

Last Monday, the Supreme Court announced it would review the commission rules by agreeing to take the case of Salim Hamdan, a Yemeni detainee and allegedly once Osama bin Laden's driver. The Graham amendment, if passed, will stop this case, and the commissions will operate without further scrutiny.

Michael Ratner, the director of New York's Centre for Constitutional Rights which brought the 2004 case, said the amendment 'will create a thousand points of darkness across the globe where the United States will be free to hold people indefinitely without a hearing, beyond the reach of US law and the checks and balances in our constitution.'

A senior Pentagon lawyer who asked not to be named said that the Graham amendment will have another consequence. The same Pentagon bill also contains a clause, sponsored by Graham and the Arizona Republican John McCain, to outlaw torture at US detention camps - a move up to now fiercely resisted by the White House. 'If detainees can't talk to lawyers or file cases, how will anyone ever find out if they have been abused,' the lawyer said.

Most of the evidence of abuse at Guantanamo has emerged from lawyers' discussions with their clients.

Human rights groups and leading figures from the US military are urging the Senate to reconsider the amendment next week. Among those who have written open letters are John Hutson, the former Judge Advocate General of the US Navy, and the National Institute for Military Justice, a think-tank for military lawyers.

[h16]

A chaud, je n'ai pas été chercher les références historiques, mais il faudrait comparer ce qui se passe actuellement avec ce qui avait été fait lors de la 2nde guerre mondiale avec les japonais alors sur le sol américain.

De toute façon, j'ai la nette impression que ce pays est en train de taillader généreusement dans ses libertés au profit d'une chimérique sécurité qu'il n'atteindra pas comme ça.

[Ronnie Hayek]

De toute façon, j'ai la nette impression que ce pays est en train de taillader généreusement dans ses libertés au profit d'une chimérique sécurité qu'il n'atteindra pas comme ça.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Voici un article de Michaël Nolan qui rejoint vos préoccupations:

http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig6/nolan-m2.html

(Spéciale dédicace to N. Luxivor)

[h16]

government leaders, unchecked, have limitless potential for harm toward the citizenry.

Voilà. Tout est dit. Ce qui arrive n'est qu'une illustration…

[Ronnie Hayek]

Un article faisant le point sur les méthodes d'interrogatoires américaines, inspirées des pratiques communistes:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/14/opinion/14blochemarks.html

Doing Unto Others as They Did Unto Us

By M. GREGG BLOCHE and JONATHAN H. MARKS

Published: November 14, 2005

Washington — How did American interrogation tactics after 9/11 come to include abuse rising to the level of torture? Much has been said about the illegality of these tactics, but the strategic error that led to their adoption has been overlooked.

Skip to next paragraph

Josh Cochran

The Pentagon effectively signed off on a strategy that mimics Red Army methods. But those tactics were not only inhumane, they were ineffective. For Communist interrogators, truth was beside the point: their aim was to force compliance to the point of false confession.

Fearful of future terrorist attacks and frustrated by the slow progress of intelligence-gathering from prisoners at Guantánamo Bay, Pentagon officials turned to the closest thing on their organizational charts to a school for torture. That was a classified program at Fort Bragg, N.C., known as SERE, for Survival, Evasion, Resistance, Escape. Based on studies of North Korean and Vietnamese efforts to break American prisoners, SERE was intended to train American soldiers to resist the abuse they might face in enemy custody.

The Pentagon appears to have flipped SERE's teachings on their head, mining the program not for resistance techniques but for interrogation methods. At a June 2004 briefing, the chief of the United States Southern Command, Gen. James T. Hill, said a team from Guantánamo went "up to our SERE school and developed a list of techniques" for "high-profile, high-value" detainees. General Hill had sent this list - which included prolonged isolation and sleep deprivation, stress positions, physical assault and the exploitation of detainees' phobias - to Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, who approved most of the tactics in December 2002.

Some within the Pentagon warned that these tactics constituted torture, but a top adviser to Secretary Rumsfeld justified them by pointing to their use in SERE training, a senior Pentagon official told us last month.

When internal F.B.I. e-mail messages critical of these methods were made public earlier this year, references to SERE were redacted. But we've obtained a less-redacted version of an e-mail exchange among F.B.I. officials, who refer to the methods as "SERE techniques." We also learned from a Pentagon official that the SERE program's chief psychologist, Col. Morgan Banks, issued guidance in early 2003 for the "behavioral science consultants" who helped to devise Guantánamo's interrogation strategy (we've been unable to learn the content of that guidance).

SERE methods are classified, but the program's principles are known. It sought to recreate the brutal conditions American prisoners of war experienced in Korea and Vietnam, where Communist interrogators forced false confessions from some detainees, and broke the spirits of many more, through Pavlovian and other conditioning. Prolonged isolation, sleep deprivation, painful body positions and punitive control over life's most intimate functions produced overwhelming stress in these prisoners. Stress led in turn to despair, uncontrollable anxiety and a collapse of self-esteem. Sometimes hallucinations and delusions ensued. Prisoners who had been through this treatment became pliable and craved companionship, easing the way for captors to obtain the "confessions" they sought.

SERE, as originally envisioned, inoculates American soldiers against these techniques. Its psychologists create mock prison regimens to study the effects of various tactics and identify the coping styles most likely to withstand them. At Guantánamo, SERE-trained mental health professionals applied this knowledge to detainees, working with guards and medical personnel to uncover resistant prisoners' vulnerabilities. "We know if you've been despondent; we know if you've been homesick," General Hill said. "That is given to interrogators and that helps the interrogators" make their plans.

Within the SERE program, abuse is carefully controlled, with the goal of teaching trainees to cope. But under combat conditions, brutal tactics can't be dispassionately "dosed." Fear, fury and loyalty to fellow soldiers facing mortal danger make limits almost impossible to sustain.

By bringing SERE tactics and the Guantánamo model onto the battlefield, the Pentagon opened a Pandora's box of potential abuse. On Nov. 26, 2003, for example, an Iraqi major general, Abed Hamed Mowhoush, was forced into a sleeping bag, then asphyxiated by his American interrogators. We've obtained a memorandum from one of these interrogators - a former SERE trainer - who cites command authorization of "stress positions" as justification for using what he called "the sleeping bag technique."

"A cord," he explained, "was used to limit movement within the bag and help bring on claustrophobic conditions." In SERE, he said, this was called close confinement and could be "very effective." Those who squirmed or screamed in the sleeping bag, he said, were "allowed out as soon as they start to provide information." Three soldiers have been ordered to stand trial on murder charges in General Mowhoush's death. Yet the Pentagon cannot point to any intelligence gains resulting from the techniques that have so tarnished America's image. That's because the techniques designed by communist interrogators were created to control a prisoner's will rather than to extract useful intelligence.

A full account of how our leaders reacted to terrorism by re-engineering Red Army methods must await an independent inquiry. But the SERE model's embrace by the Pentagon's civilian leaders is further evidence that abuse tantamount to torture was national policy, not merely the product of rogue freelancers. After the shock of 9/11 - when Americans desperately wanted mastery over a world that suddenly seemed terrifying - this policy had visceral appeal. But it's the task of command authority to connect means and ends rationally. The Bush administration has too frequently failed to do this. And so it is urgent that Congress step in to tie our detainee policy to our national interest.

M. Gregg Bloche is a law professor at Georgetown University and a visiting fellow at the Brookings Institution. Jonathan H. Marks, a barrister in London, is a bioethics fellow at Georgetown and Johns Hopkins.

[Invité jabial]

A chaud, je n'ai pas été chercher les références historiques, mais il faudrait comparer ce qui se passe actuellement avec ce qui avait été fait lors de la 2nde guerre mondiale avec les japonais alors sur le sol américain.

On en est quand même très loin.

De toute façon, j'ai la nette impression que ce pays est en train de taillader généreusement dans ses libertés au profit d'une chimérique sécurité qu'il n'atteindra pas comme ça.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Malheureusement, c'est le précisément le cas. La tentation de la barbarie… C'est comparable à la situation d'un homme qui a le vertige, qui doit passer sur une planche qu'il n'aurait aucune difficulté à franchir sans s'en écarter si elle était posée au sol. Plus les conséquences de l'erreur sont graves, et plus la peur pousse à la commettre.

[h16]

On en est quand même très loin.

Dans quel sens ?

[Invité jabial]

Dans quel sens ?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Bah, tous les japonais avaient quand même étés foutus dans des camps.

[xara]

Attention. Yves Roucaute dans Le Figaro aujourd'hui, comment dire… égal à lui-même.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/debats/20060607.FIG…americaine.html

[Ash]

Arf, l'esprit néocons resurgit en moi.

No comment donc.

[Invité jabial]

Je ne suis pas néo-con mais disons que les exagérations sur les US m'énervent parfois aussi. Ceci dit, le professeur en question fait de la propagande dans l'autre sens.

[Ronnie Hayek]

Attention. Yves Roucaute dans Le Figaro aujourd'hui, comment dire… égal à lui-même.

http://www.lefigaro.fr/debats/20060607.FIG…americaine.html

Il se surpasse. On reconnaît l'ex-communiste. Sa fascination pour la puissance reste identique, seul l'objet de son désir a changé.

http://chacun-pour-soi.blogspot.com/2004/0…gauchistes.html

Un paragraphe qui figurera dans tous les bêtisiers des 30 prochains siècles, je l'espère :

Si la vraie force des républiques réside dans la vertu, comme le montra Montesquieu, la vertu se mesure au courage de se battre pour elles. Guantanamo, c'est ce courage.

Toujours dans la même veine pravdaoïde :

Guantanamo donc. La propagande y dénonce l'isolement et le secret, réclame l'intervention des tribunaux américains, invente des prisonniers détenus sans raison, imagine tortures et viol des droits individuels.

[Ronnie Hayek]

Je n'ai pas résister au plaisir de livrer mon opinion au sujet de ce sinistre personnage :

http://chacun-pour-soi.blogspot.com/2006/0…e-new-look.html

[Punu]

Ils viennent d'annoncer qu'ils ont tué al-Zarkaoui. Une certaine joie m'a étreint pendant quelques secondes, l'idée qu'un type qui décapite des innocents avec un couteau de cuisine n'est plus de ce monde.

[Patrick Smets]

Quelle excellente nouvelle !

[Ash]

Champagne !

On remarquera en passant que la "résistance" Irakienne n'est pas au mieux de sa forme.

[Ash]

Pris sur le blog de Sisyphe

[Ronnie Hayek]

Le thème de la discussion est Guantanamo, pas l'autre enflure.

[Taranne]

A chaud, je n'ai pas été chercher les références historiques, mais il faudrait comparer ce qui se passe actuellement avec ce qui avait été fait lors de la 2nde guerre mondiale avec les japonais alors sur le sol américain.

Moui. A la différence que les "pensionnaires" de ces camps étaient citoyens américains, vivant aux Etats-Unis, et sans aucun lien autre qu'ethnique avec l'Ennemi.

Une autre comparaison possible - quoique pas plus glorieuse.

Ils viennent d'annoncer qu'ils ont tué al-Zarkaoui. Une certaine joie m'a étreint pendant quelques secondes, l'idée qu'un type qui décapite des innocents avec un couteau de cuisine n'est plus de ce monde.

Je ne me réjouis jamais de la mort d'autrui, mais pour les Irakiens c'est une bonne nouvelle.

[Ronnie Hayek]

Le thème de la discussion est Guantanamo, pas l'autre enflure.

Bon, allez, tant qu'on y est.

Spéciale dédicace à Ash :

http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2006/06/08/goo…prophetic-post/

[Antoninov]

Three Gunantanamo inmates hang themselves

Three suspected terrorists at the Guantanamo Bay detention center in Cuba hanged themselves with clothing and bed sheets Saturday, the first inmates to die at the remote island prison since it opened in early 2002, according to military officials.

[…]

The deaths come just weeks after a brawl and four attempted suicides at the center, where some have been held without charges for as long as 4½ years.

[…]

Harris called the suicides “not an act of desperation, but an act of asymmetric warfare.”

“We have men here in Guantanamo who are committed jihadists, al-Qaida and Taliban,” he said. “They’re continuing to fight against us here. These are dangerous men who will do anything they can to gain support for their cause.”

Yeaaah.

Dégoûtant.

[Invité jabial]

Tout à fait possible, toutefois. Des gens qui sont capables de se faire sauter pour faire du mal à un ennmi peuvent tout à fait se pendre pour lui causer du tort.

[Antoninov]

Tout à fait possible, toutefois. Des gens qui sont capables de se faire sauter pour faire du mal à un ennmi peuvent tout à fait se pendre pour lui causer du tort.

Euh… attends on parle de "combattants ennemis" arrêtés pour la majorité en afghanistan, non?, pas de kamikazes…

[foxxbat]

S'il s'agissait de types capables de se faire sauter, ce dont on n'avait pas la preuve me semble-t-il…

[Invité jabial]

Je n'ai pas dit que c'était nécessairement le cas, seulement que c'était possible. Il doit tout de même y avoir quelques terroristes parmi tous les détenus

[h16]

Je n'ai pas dit que c'était nécessairement le cas, seulement que c'était possible. Il doit tout de même y avoir quelques terroristes parmi tous les détenus

C'est exact. Tuons les tous. Dieu reconnaîtra les siens.

[Ronnie Hayek]

C'est exact. Tuons les tous. Dieu reconnaîtra les siens.

Phrase apocryphe, entre parenthèses.

[Invité Arn0]

Phrase apocryphe, entre parenthèses.

Phrase douteuse mais apocryphe c'est pas certain… la source de cette phrase c'est quand même le texte d'un moine.

[Ronnie Hayek]

Phrase douteuse mais apocryphe c'est pas certain… la source de cette phrase c'est quand même le texte d'un moine.

Apocryphe=d'une authenticité douteuse.

Au demeurant, depuis la fin du XIXe siècle, on sait qu'elle n'a jamais été retrouvée dans aucune autre source qu'un manuscrit dû au moine dont tu parles - Césaire de Heisterbach, auteur du Livre des Miracles et historiographe peu scrupuleux.

[Invité Arn0]

Apocryphe=d'une authenticité douteuse.

Définition du Larousse :

Apocryphe du grec tenu secret

Non authentique; douteux, secret.